Listen. We are really burnt out this week, we both had difficult weekends that culminated in us getting inexplicably deactivated on YouTube and then just as mysteriously unsuspended, so we hit the whiskey today to talk freely about everything from She-Ra (spoiler-free!) to our views on the current fall of capitalism and our dreams to join a supportive community somewhere. An unfocused, fun, rowdy conversation.
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Nichole [00:00:26] Hi, everyone. I’m Nichole.
Callie [00:00:29] And I’m Callie.
Nichole [00:00:30] And today we’ll be bitching about…
Callie [00:00:33] No idea yet. Everything?
Nichole [00:00:40] Yeah. So we kind of needed a break today, we’ll be real with everyone, and so we’re basically just going to bitch about a bunch of random shit. And we’re probably going to talk about She-Ra.
Callie [00:00:50] Mm hmm. Mm hmm.
Nichole [00:00:52] And maybe also talk about the current dismantling of the myth of the American Dream that we see happening and what we see, possibly little seedlings of hope, of how people seem to be creating something new in its place. But that sounds way out of character for how grumpy I am and for the fact that I have whiskey and an empty stomach so we’ll see how it goes. We’ll see how it goes.
Callie [00:01:22] Yeah.
Nichole [00:01:22] So this is gonna be an episode for BSS lovers who actually like when we just go off on tangents and are unstructured and messy.
Callie [00:01:34] Yeah, if this is your first episode please skip it and go listen to something else.
Nichole [00:01:43] Yeah, don’t judge us by this.
Callie [00:01:45] Yeah.
Nichole [00:01:45] Unless you love it in which case this is very on brand.
Callie [00:01:49] Oh my god, Mohera says, “The Random Shit Bitchy Shitshow,” y’all are the best at coming up with these!
Nichole [00:01:57] No, Mohera already had another amazing tagline for us today.
Callie [00:02:00] Today?! What was it?
Nichole [00:02:01] Yes girl, today! Up thread. She was like a podcast for when, you know how my memory is, it was like a podcast for when you need whiskey because it’s one of those days. And I was like, girl!
Callie [00:02:14] Oh, I feel that in my soul. Oh my god. Kate, “BSS STANS ARE HERE FOR THE MESSINESS IN ALL ITS GLORY,” in all caps.
Nichole [00:02:28] We appreciate you.
Callie [00:02:30] I love it. I didn’t get to comment on this earlier, but Megan called me glorious and thank you.
Nichole [00:02:38] I saw that, that was lovely.
Callie [00:02:40] I live by that.
Nichole [00:02:41] It’s nice to be called glorious.
Callie [00:02:42] I don’t feel it, so I really appreciate it.
Nichole [00:02:46] Alex is suggesting I have a snack, which is probably a good idea, but I don’t really have any snacky foods around. So… All I have is like dried fruit, and that’s just gonna make things worse.
Callie [00:02:59] Oh yeah.
Nichole [00:03:00] Because adding sugar into that mix is not going to be helpful. We’ll figure it out. It’ll be fine. Mommy will be fine, or she’ll be very drunk. It’s, either way. We’ll all get through it together.
Callie [00:03:14] One way or the other.
Nichole [00:03:15] Sometimes you need to see your mommy just have a human day. And that’s what this is going to be.
Callie [00:03:22] Dude, that’s too real.
Nichole [00:03:23] This is one of those days where mommy’s like, you know what? Go microwave some mac and cheese. Go watch all the fucking cartoons you want. I don’t give a shit. I’m just gonna be over here with my pino grige and, you know, soap operas or whatever moms do.
Callie [00:03:40] I love it. So he says dried fruit is not gonna soak up the alcohol. Just add more sugar.
Nichole [00:03:52] No. Even though it’s dehydrated it will not do the trick.
Callie [00:03:55] No.
Nichole [00:03:56] Yeah. Although I do have dried cherries and they are delicious, but they’re not gonna work.
Callie [00:04:02] Ah, I am so jealous.
Nichole [00:04:03] I know.
Callie [00:04:04] I was just thinking I need to buy cherries because I-
Nichole [00:04:07] Although, sorry continue. I’m just going to keep it up so don’t forget.
Callie [00:04:12] I was just going to say I had some bananas that I let get too ripe so I froze them, and I’m like if I had some dried tart cherries I could make nice cream!
Nichole [00:04:22] Well I wish I had known, I could have left you cherries on the porch! And we could have had… Look at, we would have had mutual aid. How beautiful would that have been? Well, maybe after this I could run, I could drunkenly stumble over and leave you dried cherries, and then we’ll have taken care of each other today.
Callie [00:04:42] That would be lovely.
Nichole [00:04:43] Look! Do you see what our hilarious… It’s a seasonal tip. It really is.
Callie [00:04:50] As much as I hate that that’s true.
Nichole [00:04:56] No, but I was going to say, even though I love the dried cherries that I have, because they’re dried cherries and they’re tart, which is my favorite.
Callie [00:05:04] Mm hmm.
Nichole [00:05:04] They have sugar in them. And you know I can’t fucking stand it when people put sugar in dried fruit. Dried fruit is already a sugar. It does not need additional sugar. Some of us are prone to UTIs and we don’t need all that extra sugar in our system, OK? TMI? Get used to it.
Callie [00:05:27] Yeah, I mean, if that’s a surprising TMI you really must be new here. OK.
Nichole [00:05:40] That was gross. I made one of my favorite things. I put chia seeds in water overnight and I leave a little bit of space and then I put cherry juice concentrate in the rest and a little bit of lemon. I’m obsessed with cherries, it’s true. But the chia seeds all dried together and I just got like a giant glop at once. And it was not pleasant.
Callie [00:06:06] No. I have to just highlight this. Ben, “This mutual aid is in my vegan town fantasy. Nooch Valley will be something one day.”.
Nichole [00:06:17] Nooch Valley. I’m here for it.
Callie [00:06:19] I, listen…
Nichole [00:06:20] Actually that was one of the things that we were maybe gonna go off about today was some kind of commune situation, some kind of mutual aid community situation that we could be a part of.
Callie [00:06:33] Yeah.
Nichole [00:06:35] We basically want to get a list of skills that people have and then see if we can create a autonomous community with our listener’s skills.
Callie [00:06:46] Yeah. I know, I’m ready to just, like, pack it in, y’all. I’m just like done with mainstream society. I like can’t even anymore.
Nichole [00:06:57] Yeah.
Callie [00:06:58] Just letting out my full basic bitch white girl. I just can’t even with any of this anymore. I’m just ready to go, like, you know, off in, like and have my great little commune, communist, queer, ancom community.
Nichole [00:07:18] All the coms.
Callie [00:07:19] All the coms. And just-
Nichole [00:07:20] Just a comtopia.
Callie [00:07:21] Just check the fuck out as much as possible. Oh, look at you pulling up resources like a professional.
Nichole [00:07:29] It’s not a resource, it’s a bitch.
Callie [00:07:32] Oh.
Nichole [00:07:33] I was going to say, so I posted this from Twitter yesterday, but I just thought this was very funny and this is totally the mood. Like it’s 10 p.m. trending on Twitter is Kanye West running for president, Benadryl, World War III, and Jill Stein. I give up.
Callie [00:07:51] No.
Nichole [00:07:51] And I was like, too fuckin relatable.
Callie [00:07:55] That’s so real. It’s, I’m sure for all of you too, but it sounded like a fucking war zone outside of, like in our neighborhood last night. And it’s like, who the fuck is out here celebrating the Fourth of July? First of all, like, really? With everything going on, you’re really out here celebrating the Fourth of July? And second of all, it’s like fireworks? Fireworks. Like, we all know how bad they are. They’re fucking traumatizing to animals and non-human animals alike. They’re bad for the environment. Considering what’s been going on in the world, I don’t know if those are gunshots or fireworks. I mean, police could like…
Nichole [00:08:34] No, there was one-
Callie [00:08:36] I mean, we have the military marching down the streets. And it’s like for all I know…
Nichole [00:08:40] Someone lit something really close to me, and I like legit didn’t know for a second like which it was. I was so on edge all night. And then the cop cars, like the sirens were going all night. And I was like, oh. And then I was on Twitter and seeing people’s pictures of their poor pets that were like hiding and just shaking and so traumatized. And I was like, what are we doing?
Callie [00:09:11] I don’t know, man.
Nichole [00:09:13] Yeah, I can handle it. So, we got canceled by YouTube yesterday. That was super fun.
Callie [00:09:26] Yeah. It was not fun.
Nichole [00:09:29] Yeah, it was not fun. We got an e-mail, I don’t know, sometime in the evening, and they were just like-
Callie [00:09:36] 8:30 p.m.!
Nichole [00:09:38] And they were just like, you have repeated violations, your account has been suspended. And like, it was like closed, like deactivated. Like, I literally couldn’t even, it didn’t exist anymore. I couldn’t even like, log into it. I couldn’t do anything. And then my account, because you have to have like a personal account to have a business account, and my account, they were like, you cannot create any YouTube channels at all. So, like, even if we were like, okay, we’ll have to start over, we couldn’t. And then they said it was because we had content that was either a spam, scam or commercially deceptive or something like that? And I was like, what the fuck are you talking about? Where an anticapitalist podcast, like, we don’t sell anything. Like, what are we… What are we scamming people with, besides our radical leftist ideas?
Nichole [00:10:37] And so I appealed it, you can like fill out this form, and it got released thankfully. But I don’t know if everyone is aware, I know other content creators are painfully aware of this. But like YouTube can literally just shut you down, and they don’t even ever have to, like, actually give you a reason. You cannot contact anybody, like a human, to, you can’t contact a human like at YouTube to talk to. They send you through G Suite and then G Suite is like, well, we don’t have any control over YouTube. So all they can do is maybe review any notes that they can find. But it’s, yeah, it’s a mess. And Mohera was telling us last night that, like I think Mohera you said your boyfriend was saying like YouTube is shutting down a bunch of accounts. And I’ve heard that they target, you know, small accounts like this. So before they get big they’ll, like if you’re, you know, anticapitalist, you’re not going to make them money, then it’s easier to shut us down because, like, we don’t have enough people to, like, create enough of a ruckus to protect ourselves.
Nichole [00:11:49] So anyway, having, you know, pity for myself for a day, I’m going to wallow in it. But also just be aware like this happens to a lot of content creators. And they, the algorithm and this like review process they have seems to particularly target like LGBTQ people and people of color, basically anyone doing like radical activism. So that’s a thing.
Callie [00:12:19] Yeah. Yeah, one of these days I really would like to do like an episode, like a full-on discussion about why we really shouldn’t be cheering on these companies, like banning people as much as like… Your face! As much as obviously I like, hate the idea of like hate speech and like right-wing propaganda being spread, right, I just feel like allowing these private companies to choose who to censor? Like, they’re giving us easy targets to hate, right, so that we cheer on their ability to, like, take people down. But it’s like they will use it against us, you know? So it’s a complicated discussion, one that I am not in the headspace for today obviously. But, yeah, I just, I felt so much empathy last night for, because I know this happens all the time to people. Like there’s one person on Twitter even that we’re following and I feel like I read about her getting banned off of Twitter, like every other fucking day, you know?
Nichole [00:13:35] Yeah. Twitter does. Instagram does it. They all do it. Zoe in the chat here said that she’s gotten her channel shut down as well. It’s fucking ridiculous. And it’s like, can you think of any other situation where someone can so easily just take away your entire business with, like a click and not even have to provide you documentation as to why? I mean, there’s a lot of people who make their living or a large chunk of their living off of YouTube. And it’s like to deplatform somebody like that when they have no other options and you don’t even have a, what do they call that, a path to mediation or like due process or anything? It’s just ridiculous.
Callie [00:14:27] Yeah.
Nichole [00:14:27] And I’ve, I was, you know, researching online to see, like, what our options were, and this happens to people all the time. Like their whole account will get shut down and they’ll say that they’ve been, they’ve had like multiple incidences and the person’s like, I never got anything. Literally, it just was like shut down out of nowhere and now I can’t get anyone to talk to me. So it’s… Callie was talking last night about how, you know, these companies get so big that the service they provide is essentially like a public utility, but they still have all the protections of a private entity and have just ridiculous amounts of power. So, yeah, again, deplatforming is obviously like a very complex conversation, but at the end of the day, these corporations should not have a monopoly on something and then also have full protection from any liability.
Nichole [00:15:24] Jimmy Dore had a video about this with Trump trying to take away Twitter’s shield because Twitter was trying to like fact check him and censor him. Which like, that is weird. I don’t even understand why that’s happening. Just because, like Twitter, it’s not like Twitter like, cares. So it’s just weird. Anyway, he was saying, like, it’s true, these social media platforms have a shield from being sued for any content that is on their platform. And the tradeoff for that should be that they can’t fact check anybody. So they’re, they should be like a bookstore or like, what was the other thing he, like a printing press? So you have a publisher. Publishers can be sued for publishing incorrect information or for libel or whatever. Libel? I don’t think that’s the word… Slander.
Nichole [00:16:28] You know, so there’s that tradeoff there. But with something like a printing press, you’re not going to sue a printing press for like printing whatever, because it’s just where the information goes through. So it’s like you have to have one or the other. You either have to have a process where we can, we have due process and we can actually go through something and there’s accountability, if you’re going to be fact-checking and censoring people, and in that you can be sued. Or you have to just act like, this is just a space where people put stuff and then the community has input on how to like, control that information or what to do with it. But it shouldn’t be the company controlling that.
Nichole [00:17:10] And we see that, these algorithms are so racist. They’re homophobic. They’re every, you know, they’re very right-leaning. The algorithm even, I was even watching I think the newest Lindsay Ellis video where she’s saying, like, Titanic’s good actually. And she talks about how the YouTube algorithm greatly prefers negative videos. So she’s like, this video isn’t going to perform as well because I’m not ripping on Titanic, I’m actually saying it’s good.
Callie [00:17:44] Is it wrong that my first thought was, well, at least that’s a point in our favor?
Nichole [00:17:50] I’m like, we got that on lock. That’s fine.
Callie [00:17:55] We’re always like shitting on everyone’s faves. We literally became friends with someone because they started listening to our show and they were like, I fuckin, like you just ripped apart this like, childhood movie that I love, like how dare you.
Nichole [00:18:14] Yeah, like I meant to rant about this earlier. But, you know, I constantly watch, like, media analysis, I constantly watch stuff about racism, about, you know, all this stuff that we talk about on the show. I’m constantly watching YouTube videos about this and yet everyone I’m shown for the most part is white. So I’ve been, I don’t know how I stumbled into it, but I finally stumbled into some recommendations for like, Black LeftTubers. I don’t know if they classify themselves that way, but just the kind of general content. And I was finding people that I fucking love and I know there’s For Harriet and Jewelsy and there’s someone else I’m forgetting. But they all make content that I’m like, this is literally exactly the kind of content and constantly watch, and the only difference is that they’re Black and not white.
Nichole [00:19:09] Like the titles of their videos, the content of their videos. All of it is like, I have literally like looked shit up about this, one of them and I apologize I can’t remember which one, but one of them even did something about The Handmaid’s Tale. And I was like, listen, listen, I have watched every fucking video on The Handmaid’s Tale. I’ve read every article like, and you didn’t recommend this to me. This shit is just…
Callie [00:19:39] Racist, yeah.
Nichole [00:19:39] It’s racist, yeah. It’s transphobic, it’s sexist, it’s, well I don’t know if it’s sexist. Probably. But whatever. But yeah, it’s just, it’s all bullshit. And so you’re trying to play this game and then you just have this constant knowledge that like they could just take your channel away literally for no reason.
Callie [00:20:02] Yeah, no, it’s just really outrageous.
Nichole [00:20:09] It’s outrageous.
Callie [00:20:10] Also, I just since we’re ranting, I know we kind of wrapped this up so I’ll make this quick. But I’m just really tired of all the performative, like attacking Trump on Twitter bullshit, you know? Like people being like, “He should get banned off of Twitter.” It’s like he’s the president. He’s not going to be banned, like Twitter is not going to ban him. You know, as much as it makes me want to vomit, just calling him our president, I’m just like this is what we’re focused on? Like this is the level of our discourse? People are really like, let’s get him banned off of Twitter. Like, do you know what I mean?
Nichole [00:20:47] Those are the same people who have been trying to get networks to not air his press conferences.
Callie [00:20:52] Yeah, I just, the fucking platform is like not the most important thing. It’s like the results of all of this bullshit, you know? And that’s why it like opened the door where Trump tried to sign that executive order making it so like you can either use the argument that you’re just a platform allowing people to post their thoughts, or you can be spreading certain types of, you know, propaganda messages. It’s like, you cannot have both. Anyway.
Nichole [00:21:25] Exactly.
Callie [00:21:26] I’m just really over it.
Nichole [00:21:28] Well, the comments blew up with all kinds of interesting and legit information. So, say a collective thank you to you all. NP recommended, let’s see if I can find it, Algorithms of Oppression is a good book on this. And also Weapons of Math Destruction. Math with a t h. Yeah. And I’ve been meaning to read up on some of that because I’ve heard, you know, just around about how these algorithms, and also like trying to educate myself about how the YouTube algorithm works. But I’ve been meaning to either watch a documentary or read a book like and learn. Even though I’ve been avoiding it because I know it’s just going to make me angry and powerless feeling.
Callie [00:22:19] Yeah. Ben-
Nichole [00:22:19] But still. Someone suggested PeerTube that we could join. I would love to move to a different platform. I just know the, I don’t think the audience is quite there. And we’re trying to grow. So it’s yeah, it’s a catch 22 kind of thing but I will definitely look into it. Zoe said I’m not drunk enough yet if I can still pronounce “math”. So, sorry I interrupted you, what were you saying, Ben?
Callie [00:22:50] Oh, I was just saying-
Nichole [00:22:51] Said something cute?
Callie [00:22:52] No, actually something terrible just happened to Ben.
Nichole [00:22:57] Aww.
Callie [00:22:57] Yeah. Spilled their water and then when tried to grab the glass, scratched their monitor.
Nichole [00:23:04] I’m sorry.
Callie [00:23:05] Yeah. Now Ben has a mess and a broken monitor, yay. I mean, not, that was a sarcastic yay, obviously. Yeah.
Nichole [00:23:16] Yeah, shit like that happens to me all the time, and I just get this weird, I just look at it and I’m like, if I could just go back in time a few seconds, this wouldn’t exist. I don’t know if anyone else thinks that way, but it like, haunts me.
Callie [00:23:30] Wait, say that again.
Nichole [00:23:31] Like, if something like that happens, I’ll just think to myself, like if I just hadn’t picked up my glass right then. You know, like it’s such a small thing caused like this permanent damage. And I like can’t… I don’t know, it’s how my brain works. And then I’ll just like obsess about how like, if I just hadn’t done this one thing, things would be fine, and I like can’t let it go. So anyway.
Callie [00:23:55] I hate when something bad happens and you just kind of get like frozen because you’re just like-
Nichole [00:24:01] Yeah, I get like, stuck in it.
Callie [00:24:03] Kind of shocked and horrified at, like, what just happened. Like, do you remember that day? So there was a very long day of recording and Nichole and I had decided to like order takeout. This was like years ago, probably earlier on in our show.
Nichole [00:24:15] Do you all remember that time we got takeout?
Callie [00:24:19] I was talking to you.
Nichole [00:24:22] It’s like BSS trivia. It’s like what episode did we order takeout?
Callie [00:24:28] Like literally all of them.
Nichole [00:24:30] Literally all of them.
Callie [00:24:31] No, so we had like had this super long day of recording and we had ordered food and we were both so overly hungry and tired and burnt out. We were gonna like eat sushi and, vegan sushi, and put on a movie. And I go into the kitchen to start unpacking the bags and the fucking, I had a glass bottle of, I had like some liquor bottles on the top of my fridge.
Nichole [00:24:51] Yes.
Callie [00:24:52] A bottle of red wine had somehow, like, gotten like wobbled on the fridge, fell over off the top of my fridge onto my counter, shattered. I had literally red wine on every counter, floor, like wall, cabinet. Like it was just, it looked like a fucking murder scene in there. It was just like pools of red wine in an all-white kitchen. And I just remember standing there being like, the fuck am I gunna do? It was so bad. Yeah.
Nichole [00:25:28] No, and you do, you get that chill that goes through you and it’s just like, the thing has happened and now it’s irreversible. I hate it.
Callie [00:25:37] I know. I know. And then you just want to be like, I just, I just want to, like, move. Like, I just want to walk out of this apartment and like, never come back.
Nichole [00:25:46] List it for rent and just be done. That’s a mood. I did that the other week, I sliced my finger open while I was cleaning a new knife I have. And it was just one of those things where I looked and I’m like, now I’m gonna be dealing, like, this needed stitches and I did not get any.
Callie [00:26:08] Oh, shit.
Nichole [00:26:08] So it’s healing kind of weird. But it’s fine, you know, living the American Dream, no health insurance. It’s totally fine during a pandemic, where I’m terrified to go outside, not to mention to a hospital. Living the dream. But yeah, and I just, it was just one of those things where I was like, if I just hadn’t done this with the knife, like, I wouldn’t be bleeding all over my kitchen and almost passing out while I’m trying to tend to this gaping wound in my hand.
Callie [00:26:38] Oh, girl you didn’t even tell me that happened!
Nichole [00:26:41] I know. I had a series of kitchen disasters. Well, because it’s like, what are you gonna do about it?
Callie [00:26:47] Yeah.
Nichole [00:26:48] I don’t know. But yeah I also burnt my hand and my arm. And like, these are three separate incidences and I was like, what?
Callie [00:26:58] Yeah. That’s pretty unusual for you.
Nichole [00:26:58] And then my acupuncturist. I know. My acupuncturists told me that it was like triple eclipse season or something, and I was like, okay, at least that, maybe that explains it. I don’t know.
Callie [00:27:09] I know there are like four planets right now in retrograde, whatever that means. Which Tik-Tok is all a flutter by how bad this all is.
Nichole [00:27:18] I’m sure they are.
Callie [00:27:20] Apparently also I saw this Tik-Tok last night where astrologers were like uhhh 2020 is going to be like real fucked up. And people were like haha astrology is not real. And now they’re like…
Nichole [00:27:34] Are you sure?
Callie [00:27:36] Fucking tried to tell you bitches. Also, apparently there was some mystery box in King Tut’s tomb that was opened at the end of 2019.
Nichole [00:27:47] Why?! How many fucking movies do we have to have before people get it?
Callie [00:27:58] I don’t know. But I saw a Tik-Tok about it. In fact, I thought about playing it but I don’t know if I want to. But yeah, and to make things even creepier, the box was empty. Even though the tomb had not been opened in like, thousands of years. So like that was definitely fuckin Pandora’s box. We definitely just released some curse out into the world. Well, not we. I didn’t do it but… Listen.
Nichole [00:28:22] I’m not an archeologist, OK?! Mohera, I was thinking of Indiana Jones. I’m like, I’ve known since I was a child what happens, OK?
Callie [00:28:42] Listen, yeah.
Nichole [00:28:44] You don’t do it.
Callie [00:28:44] I loved the mummy growing up. You don’t fuck with that stuff, OK?
Nichole [00:28:51] You don’t. You just don’t do it.
Callie [00:28:53] [inaudible name] said they buried an empty box hoping to mess with people 4000 years later. It worked.
Nichole [00:28:59] It’s like a, just a slow burn prank. And they’re all just laughing. They’re like, oh my god, some day.
Callie [00:29:09] That is super epic. Can you imagine?
Nichole [00:29:10] Some white guy in khakis is going to be so upset.
Callie [00:29:16] Yeah. No, it was an, it was like a white box in a tomb full of shit, and then it was fucking empty, so.
Nichole [00:29:24] Someone farted in it 4000 years ago. That’s what it was. And they’re like, oooh someday someone’s going to open it and it’s gunna be stinky!
Callie [00:29:38] The whiskey is definitely kicking in.
Nichole [00:29:42] Yup, get ready.
Callie [00:29:46] I love it.
Nichole [00:29:48] Oh my god. So apparently there’s something with the livestream chat where it’s like top chat versus live chat settings? We don’t have that on our side, so I apologize. That’s ridiculous. But anyway, if you are having trouble seeing comments that we’ve mentioned, there’s some thing at the top, I guess, where you can switch it over to see everything. Yeah, can we stop ranking everything? Can we just let people talk? Please? Yeah. So, yeah, so we were canceled. We survived. We were Twitter deactivated. We lived to tell the tale.
Callie [00:30:42] Yeah.
Nichole [00:30:49] Is everyone okay if we talk about She-Ra? I know we didn’t have a spoiler alert disclaimer. We could try to talk about it without spoilers?
Callie [00:31:02] I don’t know if I could.
Nichole [00:31:05] It’s so good. It’s so gay.
Callie [00:31:09] No, last night I was literally sitting there like, this is the gayest shit I have ever seen and I am so here for it.
Nichole [00:31:17] Girl! The end of season-
Callie [00:31:18] Like the whole end of it is just like everything fucking rainbows.
Nichole [00:31:21] Yes.
Callie [00:31:22] And I was just fucking dead.
Nichole [00:31:23] The end of season one when they learned that she like, achieves her full power when they all work together and she gets rainbow-colored power. And I was like this fucking show. I am so here for it. Her soul partner is a fucking unicorn with rainbow wings. I’m like… Living.
Callie [00:31:46] Oh, my god. I was literally dead. I was like, yeah, I just couldn’t. And then the last, I won’t give spoilers, I just saw that some people are still in the process of watching it.
Nichole [00:31:56] OK, we won’t do spoilers.
Callie [00:31:58] But like for real in the very last episode, it’s like everything is a rainbow. Like it was just like every, all the, and they snuck in little rainbows too. And I was like, there was like a full-on mini rainbow flag emoji that just like, was on the screen at some point. And I was like, they were like, do you get it? It was like, it’s obvious-
Nichole [00:32:18] They’re like, we’re real fucking gay.
Callie [00:32:21] Yeah, as Nichole telling a joke. Just being like, do you get it? Do you get it?
Nichole [00:32:25] Do you get it?
Callie [00:32:25] Do you see all the rainbows? Do you see them? It’s like yeah, we get it.
Nichole [00:32:31] And even the hetero relationships are just like so good and cute and like everyone is just so adorable.
Callie [00:32:38] I don’t believe that there are any hetero relationships on that show. I think they’re all queer.
Nichole [00:32:44] Well yeah that’s true, they’re probably all queer. They were using that word “friend” a lot and I was like, do y’all know what that word means? Cause I, you seem to be using it for a lot of different things. Like someone at one point was like, “my ex-friend” and I was like… OK.
Callie [00:33:04] Yeah. I mean, I’m all for like, very close friendships, but like I do not think a single couple of friends on that show was like, really friends. I was like, there is some tension.
Nichole [00:33:17] Yeah. There was a lot of tension going around.
Callie [00:33:17] That is not friend tension.
Nichole [00:33:22] NP is asking what the premise of the show is. I think She-Ra is like He-Man related. I didn’t really watch He-Man so I don’t know. And that’s why I wasn’t like, interested in She-Ra either. But then everyone kept talking about how great it was. And I was like, well, you know, I was hesitant about Steven Universe and I was hesitant about Adventure Time and I ended up being so wrong, you know? So I was like, let me check this out. So anyway, She-Ra, there’s a land… How do you even explain it?
Nichole [00:33:57] It’s kind of superhero stuff in a way, like kind of more magical, I guess? More fantasy-driven. But yeah, it’s just about like friends learning to work together to defeat evil and, like, restore their home. And there’s like magical powers to be discovered. And a hero’s journey. And then lots of friendships which mostly turn out to be gay shit. But it’s just so, the animation is so beautiful. Like the character development is incredible. The story is incredible. I do have some, like, nitpicky things I could say but, you know, I’ll save it for if we ever do an episode about it. Or I might make a video about it. But yeah, highly, highly recommend.
Nichole [00:34:46] Like I just, I could not believe like how much, like Seahawk? Season one episode four is still my fave even after watching the whole series, my favorite episode. Because he just, I was like laughing out loud. And he’s not the type of character that I would normally like. Like, I often would probably be annoyed by someone like him, but like every time he was like, “Shanti!” I was like, dying!
Callie [00:35:15] Oh, I fucking died! And the princess was always like, “No!” When in the finale he was like gunna, you know, sing a Shanti, and she was like, “Why are you like this?!”.
Nichole [00:35:26] Like in the middle of this giant battle, he’s like, “Shanti!” Oh my god. And he’s hot so it’s like…
Callie [00:35:31] So hot.
Nichole [00:35:32] Everyone on the show, is beautiful. Just like beautiful humans, which is confusing because I think they’re supposed to be teenagers so I was like, not sure how to feel about stuff. But story of being gay later in life.
Callie [00:35:49] Yeah.
Nichole [00:35:51] But like, yeah, it just, it’s such a feel-good series. It like actually deals with some really heavy shit. But like overall you just feel like amazing watching it and it’s just really, really good.
Callie [00:36:01] It’s so good. Dude, the episode where they all had to go undercover and got dressed up. I was like, excuse the fuck out of y’all. How dare you?
Nichole [00:36:10] All of you! I know!
Callie [00:36:10] How dare you.
Nichole [00:36:12] Or princess Prom? Catra in that fucking tuxedo. I was like, excuse you? OK?
Callie [00:36:22] No, for real. Yeah, Scorpio in the episode where they dressed up to go undercover? I was like, Listen.
Nichole [00:36:28] Sexpot.
Callie [00:36:31] So good.
Nichole [00:36:33] Mohera says everyone in Bitchy Shitshow should be required to watch She-Ra. I agree. Yeah, the only gripe I have that I can say without spoilers is like obviously Catra is giving off lesbian vibes and those nails girl? Because she’s like top energy. So yeah, could be a problem.
Callie [00:36:59] Yeah. Well, I don’t know.
Nichole [00:36:59] I just kept looking at them and I was like umm?
Callie [00:37:02] Yeah, yeah. I mean, I have some mixed feelings about how much fuckin damage Catra did. And I’m like…
Nichole [00:37:12] I know.
Callie [00:37:13] You know, I’m like, I get that you have like, some major abandonment issues. I’m not going to give any spoilers, but I’m just like-
Nichole [00:37:19] Well this is kind of spoilery.
Callie [00:37:20] Oh, OK I’ll stop then.
Nichole [00:37:22] But I’m, I’m… I’m with you.
Callie [00:37:24] Yeah, I was just like-
Nichole [00:37:25] Yeah, that would be like something I’d want to maybe do a video about or talk about on the show, is that because I was like, this is playing into my pathology, you know? Like it would have, if I was younger, reinforced a lot of like bad stuff. I, yeah anyway.
Callie [00:37:44] Yeah. Yeah, I mean I love a redemption so I get any shows that are trying to like, you know.
Nichole [00:37:50] Yes.
Callie [00:37:50] But I was like, holy fuck, y’all.
Nichole [00:37:52] Well and I think that show had a beautiful thread of restorative justice which I really appreciated. I just think like, yeah, they didn’t quite get all the way there with some of the stuff.
Callie [00:38:03] Yes.
Nichole [00:38:03] We had a comment that the Bitchy Shitshow starter pack should be She-Ra, Ishmael, whiskey and rage. Honestly turn that into a t-shirt.
Callie [00:38:13] That makes me so proud. If that’s the legacy that we’re going to leave on the internet, I will die a happy person.
Nichole [00:38:23] But yeah, actually Everett started a Discord category for media, and two channels for She-Ra specifically. And what you were bringing up, we were talking about in a spoiler channel at length the other day because I was like, I need to talk to someone about this. But yeah.
Callie [00:38:43] Yeah. I’ll have to go in there then and talk, because yeah I like just finished it and I was like, uhhh, I don’t… I mean, listen, I was here for it, but also I was like this is very problematic.
Nichole [00:38:56] Right. Well we just need a little more work to be done before we get there.
Callie [00:38:59] Yeah.
Nichole [00:39:03] Yeah.
Callie [00:39:03] Yeah. All right.
Nichole [00:39:05] Hey, do you wanna hear a joke?
Callie [00:39:08] Sure.
Nichole [00:39:10] Did you want to get away with not hearing a joke today?
Callie [00:39:12] No.
Nichole [00:39:17] So we got this in our firstname.lastname@example.org mailbox, which pleased me greatly. Because someone was using the e-mail box that we set up.
Callie [00:39:29] It’s really weird the way you’re saying that.
Nichole [00:39:30] And not spoiling the joke for you.
Callie [00:39:37] Yeah.
Nichole [00:39:37] I’ve seen so many good jokes, but they’re like in public and I’m like, damn, I can’t take it. So this is from Stef with an F.. So thanks Stef. How many Trump supporters does it take to change a light bulb?
Callie [00:39:54] I don’t know.
Nichole [00:39:56] None. Trump just tells them that it’s been changed and they stand in the dark and applaud.
Callie [00:40:04] Oof. That was good.
Nichole [00:40:05] Ba dum tss.
Callie [00:40:07] Yeah, that was good.
Nichole [00:40:08] That’s like not even a punch line. It’s just like the news.
Callie [00:40:15] Mm hmm, mm hmm, yeah.
Nichole [00:40:16] Yeah.
Callie [00:40:20] Well.
Nichole [00:40:21] So, the American Dream.
Callie [00:40:25] Ugh, yeah.
Nichole [00:40:27] Ugh! So we have been feeling, I know, everyone’s like that was a dark joke, jokes are supposed to be funny.
Callie [00:40:37] Are they?
Nichole [00:40:38] Listen, I work with what I’m given. Yeah, if that is the standard that we’re having around here, then the whole joke segment is going to fall apart.
Callie [00:40:50] Uhh. Aw, we made Birdie sad.
Nichole [00:40:55] I know. Well, listen, sometimes mommy needs to get drunk and just tell you the fucking truth, OK?
Callie [00:41:02] It’s true.
Nichole [00:41:02] Sometimes she can’t sugar coat things for you.
Callie [00:41:04] Mm hmm, it’s true.
Nichole [00:41:08] But point taken, no more depressing jokes. Zoe thinks we’re funny! Or the commenters are funny, hmm. Who’s getting the compliment?
Callie [00:41:29] That just fucking killed me.
Nichole [00:41:32] Now I don’t know who y’all are talking to.
Callie [00:41:32] The fact that you just tried to make it a compliment for us and were unsure.
Nichole [00:41:38] Well how, yeah, I mean…
Callie [00:41:39] Oh my god.
Nichole [00:41:41] I’m trying to temper the narcissism.
Callie [00:41:47] Oh my god.
Nichole [00:41:50] I love, Debbie said, no I’m goth, I love dark jokes, bring it on. Thank you.
Callie [00:41:54] Yeah, see? I mean, to be fair, the only times you’ve really gotten me to laugh at a joke is when they’re like hashtag too real, and kinda dark, so.
Nichole [00:42:01] This is true. That’s when I’m pandering.
Callie [00:42:04] Yeah, to me?
Nichole [00:42:07] Yeah. I’m like, this one’s too real, she’ll like it.
Callie [00:42:11] Oh my god.
Nichole [00:42:13] The kids will be sad, but, you know, happy wife, happy life. So what are you gonna say? It’s just, I just let my wife walk all over me. It’s a thing that heterosexual men say. It’s the world we’re living in.
Callie [00:42:35] Oh good god.
Nichole [00:42:37] Zoe’s saying maybe I’ve had enough to drink?
Callie [00:42:42] That they have or that you have?
Nichole [00:42:44] I have.
Callie [00:42:52] Oh my goodness.
Nichole [00:42:52] Yep. So, yeah, we’ve just been, you know, looking around and listening to our friends and seeing stuff on social media and listening to other people’s podcasts. And it does seem that there is becoming a chink in the American Dream armor for the mainstream. Because obviously other people have always known and of course, I’m talking about the libs and the whites and the, whatever we’re calling the middle class nowadays. But, yeah, it seems like we have been hearing from and seeing a lot of people that we wouldn’t have expected, to be kind of like, this is fucking bullshit and looking for alternative solutions kind of coming out of the woodwork. So, we’re encouraged. We’re hopeful. The message seems to be getting out there.
Callie [00:43:50] Yeah.
Nichole [00:43:51] And we were just, you know, we were going back and forth on Marco Polo the other night, which is a video messaging app. If you don’t have it, highly recommend, it’s one of my faves. Although they’re fucking around now with some updates and stuff. I don’t like it. But anyway, there’s a premium version now, and that’s when things always go to hell. But anyway, you know, we were just talking about how like we have… So I think for me, between Braiding Sweetgrass for our book club, which is wonderful. If you’re interested in joining, contact us for a link to the Discord server.
Nichole [00:44:30] But we’re reading it for our book club, and I just remember there is this story about The Three Sisters, which is, and forgive me if I don’t get this exactly right, but it’s basically squash, like pumpkin corn and green beans. You plant those seeds together and they grow in this really mutually beneficial way where they yield more by growing together than they would yield by growing apart. And I don’t know what it was exactly about her, the author describing this way of farming. But it like, honestly, I had this moment where I was like, I would give up everything right now to live somewhere where we were doing things in this way. And it made me so curious about like what are other combinations of plants that work really well together and what are other ways of farming and gardening where we can have these higher yields and let the land kind of like be more in a natural state?
Nichole [00:45:32] Because she talked a lot about how she, they were growing plants in this way, but she lived in an area where she could see cornfields from her house. And the cornfields were, of course, all in these straight rows. And she talked about how the corn was like colonized and was, you know, replicating the people who had planted it. Being in these straight lines, being a mono-crop, being like, you couldn’t just go up and eat it, right? So it just was this really, she talked about how when settlers came to this country, they thought that indigenous people didn’t know how to farm because the way they grow crops is like, it looks very natural. They don’t grow crops in a straight line and they don’t isolate the plants.
Nichole [00:46:21] So I just, I don’t know what it was. And I’ve been feeling this way a lot lately. But this was like a moment where it just kind of like overcame me. And I was very emotional about like, I would just, I really would like walk away from so much of what we have today to just be somewhere where we’re, I just could picture, like all of us harvesting together and planting together and like cooking for a group of people off the harvest. Because she describes like them harvesting and then cooking this like celebratory feast with the stuff that they harvested. And I was like, fuck. Like, I don’t need all this stuff, you know? And I just have heard from friends, like I have one friend who’s legit, like fucking moving and is just like I’m going to try to find somewhere quiet to live and I just don’t want to deal with this shit anymore, you know? And this is someone like I never, ever would have thought would have felt this way. But I feel like we’re seeing this come out, like I feel like the cracks in capitalism are starting… Like, I feel like the bribe of capitalism is starting to wear thin for a lot of people that I wouldn’t have expected to see through it. And that’s really encouraging.
Callie [00:47:45] Yeah. Yeah, I agree.
Nichole [00:47:47] So, yeah, I just, you know, been seeing, I’ve been listening to the Benjamin Dixon Show and he was talking a lot about us as consumers. Like he calls a lot for consumer strikes because he says that, like, he’s not out in the streets because he has a wife and kids and he’s, you know, too afraid to get killed. And so he’s like, I don’t feel that I can ask other people to do what I’m not able or willing to do. But he talks about, you know, those of us who have expendable income, like, really looking at what we’re spending our money on and where we’re spending it. And not like boycotting, but, and we’ve kind of touched on this on the show before, but looking at like, how much can we really pull back on our consumption? What can we live without? And can we turn to each other to get some of these things instead of just ordering from Amazon or whatever it is, you know? And being able to support people in that way. And I think that that, I just hear this message a lot. People are really starting to look at these things and say, like, I mean, I’ve even done it. Like my spending is so much less than it used to be. And I’m just really like, what do I need to live right now? Except I did just by lipstick’s, which I didn’t need. But now it’s the thing and I found these really cute ones on sale.
Callie [00:49:25] Yeah.
Nichole [00:49:28] No, but it’s been interesting being in lockdown and really looking at like… Like I don’t, I ordered take out a couple times and honestly, like, I didn’t like it. And that makes me sad because I do want to support local restaurants. But like, I just can’t imagine going back out to bars and like restaurants and ordering takeout all the time. I just, I don’t want to do it, you know? And I’m trying to even, like, learn to, not learn because I kind of know but, like, relearned how to cook more simply. And, you know, it’s not just about saving money. It’s just like getting down to basics and just being like, what do I actually need, you know? And how much of what I want is like externally…
Nichole [00:50:12] I mean, like Instagram? Instagram is a fucking trap for buying shit. Instagram has the best fucking ad algorithm I’ve ever seen. Like they, I don’t know how, but they just know all of my weak points. And so, like, it’s hard because I want to be on Instagram to, like, support other people, like the people that I follow, or accounts that I really admire. And so I want to, like, give them my likes and read what they’re, you know, understand like what they’re talking about. But then you get those ads and it’s just like, fuck. So I just, like, severely limit my time on Instagram because I found that’s a place where I’ll just end up clicking through on ads and buying stuff.
Callie [00:50:50] Yeah.
Nichole [00:50:50] And sometimes you do need things, you know? Like I just ordered a new pillow, I need one. My pillow is really old and it’s like hurting my neck now and like that’s fine. But for every one thing you buy like that, you’re probably buying five others that you don’t like truly need.
Callie [00:51:07] Yeah. Yeah, I just, like I’ve always been someone who really enjoyed some of the trappings of like, you know, this consumerist culture we have. You know, like I love going out to beautiful restaurants. I love traveling like, you know, I like shopping. I’ve always been kind of like, I don’t like to have a lot of stuff around, that is kind of the one thing that I’ve always really disliked. Like, I’ve I’m not really a fan of presents just because I don’t like having to like, have things that I don’t like, truly want around me, you know? And I just don’t like this, like, kind of prescriptive like, you just need to buy people shit. It’s like, well, they probably don’t want or need it or you’re not getting them the one that they actually want. You know, like I just don’t like to have a lot of things around, like I don’t want to have drawers and cupboards and shelves that are just like full of junk, you know?
Callie [00:52:02] But I’ve just been realizing recently that all of these things I thought would make me still be like holding on to this culture, like don’t really have the appeal that they used to and that I would like happily trade them, you know, for the benefit of like not having to work a full-time job. You know, not, you know, those things that I thought I would really miss. You know, like being able to, like, go out and sit at brunch in, you know, a nice little patio restaurant with some friends on a Sunday and, you know, day drink or whatever. You know, just all those kind of fun things you do to, like, get you through the week. And I’m realizing, like, I just, it’s not, it’s no longer worth it to me. You know, I don’t wanna be all up on, like, the internet and social media all the time. Like, I don’t want to be feeling like I have to work as much as, you know, we all think we do.
Callie [00:52:53] I just kind of want, like a slower chill like, I want to work on relationships. I want to build, I want to be part, like truly part of a community. One in which it’s not just like… Like one of the things we were talking about the other night was, you know, I really want to, like, live in a community. Like I want to be part of like a mutual aid network. And not so that, like, I know people will take care of me. It’s because I want to have the meaning of knowing that, like, I’m contributing to something important. And I think that’s what’s missing for a lot of people. You know, a lot of what we do just is like, it feels like dieting. You know, like diet foods where it’s like everything’s just like very low calorie and doesn’t really sustain you. And I feel like that’s kind of what our life is. And I’m just kind of over that.
Callie [00:53:46] Like, I just want… Like Nichole and I are fortunate to live close enough together where, you know, it’s like two blocks away from each other, whatever. And we have been able to, like, grocery shop for each other and kind of help out during this quarantine and stuff. But… And I love that. I truly do. But I like want more of it. You know, like I want to be part of something. I want us to like, kind of withdraw, people to be able to like withdraw from this like culture. And I, I feel like the writing is on the wall that our government is like truly fucked. Like, no matter what happens, no matter who wins in November like, this is, we are really fucked for at least the next five, ten years at least, right?
Nichole [00:54:34] It’s a pretty critical five to ten years as well.
Callie [00:54:37] Yeah. And so I just feel like kind of withdrawing as much as possible and trying to kind of create like units, you know, like some like protection and some distance from this like capitalist culture that we’re in would feel, like feels really important. You know, knowing that we can kind of sustain ourselves a little bit, both like emotionally but also like physically, like with things like food and not having to buy stuff. And, you know, like Nichole and I are both, we have this show and we both had to kind of buy equipment to set ourselves up. And I’m like, if we were living in a community, like, we wouldn’t each have to have, like, our own space. You know, like you could have like a setup, right?
Nichole [00:55:21] Yeah. And anyone could use it.
Callie [00:55:23] Exactly! And we could all, like I don’t need to have a fucking studio set up in my apartment when I use it like twice a week, you know, for a couple hours each time. It’s just about like sharing things.
Nichole [00:55:40] Yeah, I think sharing things. I think I had mentioned when we were talking the other night, but just the concept of being around other people where we collectively have the skills we need to like do most things. Because I think that’s pretty lacking. Like some people are lucky and they have a lot of friends or they have extended family and they maybe have someone in their family who’s a plumber or have someone in their family who’s, you know, a carpenter or whatever. But like, I’ve always been pretty isolated my whole life and just knowing that I was in a space where, maybe we don’t have all skills, but just that like we are all working towards like, how autonomous can we be and how much can we help each other? And knowing that if something happened… You know, it’s like the fucking landlord argument. They’re like, well who are you going to call when your pipes burst? And it’s like, John next door who knows how to fix it? You know, like it, I don’t need to, like, have a landlord for that. I just need to because now I don’t have anyone to help me with those things and that’s how it’s structured.
Callie [00:56:52] Yeah.
Nichole [00:56:52] So, yeah, just something very liberating and empowering about thinking about consciously coming together to be as autonomous as possible. And to be like as supportive as possible. And like I would be happy to learn from someone else. Like, I’m actually pretty handy, I just don’t have a lot of experience with stuff, but I tend to pick up things like that pretty quickly. So I would like, have someone mentor me, you know, be an apprentice or whatever, and try to be one of those people who knows how to fix things.
Callie [00:57:28] Yes. Yeah, same here.
Nichole [00:57:31] But like, I would have to pay someone for that now, right? Or I would have to, like, try to watch YouTube videos and, like, do it in my rental where if I break something I’m going to have to pay for it.
Callie [00:57:41] Yes.
Nichole [00:57:42] You know, just getting out of that mindset.
Callie [00:57:44] Yeah. No, I love, I absolutely love that you use the word liberating. Like that’s kind of this energy that I have in my head when I’m like thinking about this. And I’m so not usually the kind of person who like dreams and is like, you know, like just wanting to have this, like, different kind of life. But it’s just… I am, I feel like somehow over the last month or two, like I’ve kind of mentally turned a corner in like, like I really struggle with asking for help from other people. And I really struggle with feeling like I need anything from anyone else. And so I’m definitely someone who’s, like, fallen victim to like, oh, well, now in this culture, we have like, you can just pay people so that you don’t have to, like, do the vulnerable thing to ask, right?
Callie [00:58:33] Like, when I moved into my apartment, I paid, like I had mover’s. When something’s broken, like I’ll hire someone instead of being like, hey like, can a friend, come over and like, help me do this or whatever. And I’m just realizing, like, I just, the cost of having to like work enough and live in a certain way to like keep up this like highly isolated but like self-sustaining lifestyle, just like doesn’t feel worth it anymore. You know, especially when so many of us are craving connection and want to be there for each other. You know?
Nichole [00:59:09] I know. Yeah, and NP is making some good points. By talking about like how what we’re talking about sounds like the village I think that her parents grew up in. Yeah, “The concept of mutual aid reminds me of life in my parent’s village, and probably a lot of small non-Western communities”. Absolutely. And talking about how, meanwhile my white friends sued to get paid to babysit their own siblings. And that’s the thing. That’s the thing, I don’t know if people understand this about, like white, I hate using the word culture but like white people. It’s a weird relationship because we do get shit on a lot for not respecting our elders or not being like, like the kids get shit on for not being, like, family-oriented. But the problem that we have is that so many of us have parents that don’t provide for us and we don’t have a community.
Nichole [01:00:14] That’s the way that I grew up. I had parents who exploited me from when I was small to take care of my sisters and just kind of left me there. And didn’t provide any security, didn’t make sure that we had a community around them. Opposite, my dad actually, like, intentionally isolated us from everyone else. And so there’s, and I am not trying to defend white people. I’m just saying, like, I think people hear, so I think people would hear a story like that like, oh I sued my sister to get paid for babysitting and it would make sense to them because we all have family members who just take and take and take, and like will steal from us and will lie and will do all kinds of stuff. And they’re just, it’s not like a mutually beneficial relationship. But I think we forget that, like, it doesn’t have to be that way.
Nichole [01:01:05] I think people forget that, like family isn’t supposed to function that way. You know? And it’s something I struggle with because even thinking about being part of a community, I do sometimes get nervous of like, I don’t know. Like what if someone’s, like, taking advantage of me or what if I’m overcommitting or what if I don’t know, what if I’m like losing some kind of, like, autonomy or balance in my life? But then I have to remind myself that, like, the way a community like that would function is not the way that, like, my normal day to day life functions. Where I’m very, for the most part, isolated, very on my own. And most people are not dealing with their shit and not looking at how they can mutually flourish with other people. So anyway, thank you, NP. Great comments. Too long, didn’t listen: NP’s a genius. Like so many of our listeners.
Callie [01:02:03] So many of y’all. It reminds me a lot of like the thought process I had last night. You know, like I was very badly trying to put this into words over Marco Polo after you and I were kind of dealing with our YouTube channel being taken down and then put back up. And I was saying, like, I just, I had this, like, thought spinning round in my head like a broken record, just being like I feel like there should be some sort of like, like restitution or like compensation for like what just happened to us, you know? Like we just lost like four hours dealing with this and the emotional upset. And like, that’s not the way I want to approach life. You know, and obviously there isn’t compensation for anything like that. But it just reminds me of like when we, when you live in a consumerist, capitalist culture that commodifies everything, that quantifies everything, and our time is so in short supply and so valuable. It feels like if anything happens to us, there should be some sort of like, like payback, right?
Callie [01:03:16] And I just was thinking, like, it’s just such a weird, a weird experience. Because like, you know, if we were like… If we were not us, right, if we were people that had a huge channel or like something happened, you know, like we could. Like there, we could go to, like there would be some sort of like punishment or some sort of like making this situation right, you know? When things, like when CEOs, when something bad happens, like, people get punished. You know, heads roll, they get paid back, they sue or whatever. And it just was making me think about how much in my life now I have to think about things in terms of like how much time I’ve just spent. How much time I’ve wasted. If I was working, how many hours would I have just been paid? Like I did our taxes yesterday and I was like, you know, like I work now at a job where everything we do, we have to, like, track our time, like, you know, like we work on billable time. And so it’s like trained me to think in terms of, like, billable time. And I was like, this is like six hours. That’s like not billable to anything because it’s like our own personal stuff. You know what I mean?
Nichole [01:04:33] Yeah.
Callie [01:04:33] And I don’t want to live like that. I don’t want to think that way.
Nichole [01:04:38] I also don’t want to file taxes.
Callie [01:04:39] Well yeah.
Nichole [01:04:45] But that’s what I mean. I mean, it’s, I’m joking but also I’m being serious. I don’t want to live my life for I have to track my expenses and incoming and outcoming. I just want to be like, hey, is there food? Hey, am I doing something that’s interesting to me, or am I helping someone, or am I like doing a task that the community needs me to do? I don’t want to think about like, fucking travel expenses from last year, you know? Or if this meal is deductible or not deductible or what the fuck ever.
Callie [01:05:18] Yeah. Yeah, well it just kind of reminded me of that, the conversations that we’ve had over the years, but in particular on VWPA over the high cost of being poor, and how many things more that poor people, like, lose money on or like don’t get compensated for, right? And like how little their time is worth. And I was just… Yeah, I don’t think any of this is like really coming across in the way I like intended, but it’s just… There’s just something so fucked up about constantly feeling like my time should be worth something. But I don’t actually want it to be worth anything. I just don’t want to have to then be like, oh, but now I need to, like, pay bills. You know?
Nichole [01:06:08] I think time should be valuable.
Callie [01:06:14] Mm hmm. I like that.
Nichole [01:06:15] Yeah. I think that’s what you’re saying is like time should be valuable. And that doesn’t mean money. But that’s the only, like, avenue we have now, right, to like, make our time valuable. Because we still have to fucking pay our bills.
Callie [01:06:34] Right.
Nichole [01:06:35] And that’s how I get too. Like I’m volunteering for an organization. I’m very happy to do that. But then I’m also working with a foundation and I get mad every time I don’t get, like, paid for anything I do for them. Because, like, it’s because the, I feel that the time I spend on the volunteering that I do is valuable for the work that I’m doing. You know what I mean? Like, I get something out of that that is worth it to me. I don’t care about getting paid for that. But for the other place, it’s like I’m just helping you grow your business so I want to get paid, and I get mad about it.
Callie [01:07:16] As you should.
Nichole [01:07:17] Yeah, and yeah, I just, I know what you mean. It’s like I don’t want to approach life that way, but like, the truth of the matter is, I have fuckin bills to pay and I have limited time. And especially because I’m chronically ill, I really have limited time. You know, I don’t even have the hours in the day that someone else has technically to, like, do work. So it’s like if I work for you, that’s probably the only major thing I can do in a day. So, like, you’ve taken my whole day for something that isn’t valuable to me, even if it made me money. And I think that, I think that was beautifully said, because I think that is probably at the heart of what we’re seeing people wake up to, is wanting their time to be valuable again. Because I can tell you right now like if we had a community garden and I was weeding, that would be valuable to me.
Callie [01:08:11] Yeah.
Nichole [01:08:12] You know?
Callie [01:08:13] Yeah.
Nichole [01:08:14] But right now, if I have to like go do my dishes or something, I’m just like ugh, you know? I’ve gotten better at it, actually. But like, you know, like some household chore, I would just, or if like, yeah, if someone that I wasn’t close to needed help with something it would just feel like this imposition. Cause there’s just no reciprocity, there’s no like-
Callie [01:08:37] Yes, that’s the word! That is the word.
Nichole [01:08:41] Yeah. Thank you Braiding Sweetgrass. Cause she uses that word a lot and I’m like, ah that’s such a great word. But yeah, there’s no reciprocity and there’s no sense that even something like weeding is improving my future and the future of my community. And it’s a practice of us like taking care of our space and thinking about the future, right? Cause growing food is like a future-facing kind of thing. You have to plant something today to have food tomorrow. And you’re thinking about even how the land is going to be over time and how to keep it fertile and how to best take care of it so that you have that sustained into the future. And nothing we have now is like that. It’s all transactional, and that means you always have to have, like, money to do the transactional thing. And so you just don’t feel like your time is valuable.
Callie [01:09:36] Transactional is such a good way of putting it too. And I think that’s why last night I was like struggling with this concept of, like, I’m told everything in life is based on, like, money right, and like compensation. And yet, like, I was just robbed of, like, at least four hours of my life. And all of my emotional energy was then drained out of me because of the emotional rollercoaster for literally no reason. For no reason. And there was not any sort of like acknowledgment or any sort of like other side of that transaction of like, oh, like we just get this cold email that’s like your fuckin channel is shut down because you violated our standards. And then another email that’s like, oops, just kidding, after another review, you didn’t. And it’s like, what was the point of all of it? Like, do you know what you just did to us? You know? And not to make it about us, I just mean, like in general. You know, like when they do shit, like when these big companies can just, like, fuck with people. And it’s like, it’s not just about the time. It’s not just about the emotions. It’s like everything together and the fact that it’s all the time, you know?
Nichole [01:10:49] No, I literally was like, I don’t think I can do this again.
Callie [01:10:53] Yeah.
Nichole [01:10:54] I was like, if our channel isn’t reinstated I don’t think I have the emotional strength to, like, start another channel. And that might sound dramatic, but it’s like it’s a lot of work. And it’s a lot, like we’ve been trying to build up the channel and it’s still really small and like we just had planned to do some stuff to like get out there a little bit more. And I’m like I just don’t, I don’t think I can, even now it’s gonna be hanging over my head all the time. I’m like, I don’t think I can live with this, like, not knowing why or, you know, that just someone could shut you down arbitrarily and then that’s it, you’re fucked. It sucks. And I mean, I’m sure I would have gotten over it in a few days, but like, that’s what it does to a person. It just like shuts you the fuck down.
Nichole [01:11:38] And especially if you’re a super marginalized person where you’re like, literally shut down. You know what I mean, like, your voice is like constantly shut down metaphorically. And then like in this case, like literally. You’re deplatformed. Like it’s, how do you, it just, it exhausts you and it breaks you in a way that I don’t think people like acknowledge enough. I think that’s when people call you a snowflake or something. And it’s like, no, it’s just one thing too many. And it’s like I’m literally like spending my time and energy to try to get my voice out there and you just took it away for literally no reason, like nothing happened. They even said in the email like, oh, you didn’t actually do anything wrong.
Callie [01:12:21] Yeah.
Nichole [01:12:23] And this happens to people all the time, and it’s like this is the culture we live in. You know? I was arguing for fun with someone on Twitter, which every time I do it, I’m like, why am I doing this? And he kept assuming that I, because I had posted something anticapitalist, and he kept assuming that I hated capitalism because I was a loser and I was unsuccessful. And I hate getting into these arguments because it’s like I wholeheartedly reject those concepts at their face. But I was trying to push back and be like, no, I am actually pretty successful now. I’m just a person who understands how the system works. And like, I was basically trying to say, like, I have critical thinking skills and I’ve used them to understand that, like, this sucks.
Callie [01:13:12] Yeah.
Nichole [01:13:13] Because I didn’t want him to get away with, like, oh, this person’s a loser. Which again, was fruitless because, of course, everything I said, he was just like twisting it to make it sound like I was a loser. But I remember I, you know, for some reason I was like, I quit my job last year and, you know, I’m like working for myself now, which was always the plan. And he’s like, it sounds like you need to build up. Oh, cause I mentioned I was burnt out, and he’s like, it sounds like you need to build up some mental fortuity. And I’m like, I’m a chronically ill disabled person who is working 80 hours a week and traveling one-third time. And I have a second job. But this is what people think, right? This is what people think, if something gets to you, then you’re just weak and you’re a snowflake and you need to be harder.
Nichole [01:14:02] And it’s like, why are we advocating for a system that requires people to be so hard? Why are we advocating for a system that requires people to not feel things? And he was another one of these like greatest country in the fucking world. And I was like, prove it. How? In what way? I was like, people are literally not letting us into their country at this point because we’re a fucking plague state. And yet you’re still here like fuckin America! And it’s like. Why? Anyway, I’m not saying anything any of you don’t know, but.
Callie [01:14:39] Yeah, well, and the sad thing is, is again, because we have this fucked up sense of like, we, the damages from these societies are like individualized, right? So someone like that could be like, oh, well, you just don’t have mental, you know, fortitude. And it’s like, OK, do you know how many of you fuckers have, like are abusive or abuse like substances or TV or video games or like alcohol or drugs or all of these things?
Nichole [01:15:15] Or your wives.
Callie [01:15:15] Or your wives. Like, there’s so many things, right? Like all of these like these people, especially that love to talk about like, oh, in previous generations, it’s like we didn’t, you know, we didn’t complain. It’s like, no, you just like, fucking abused everyone around. You know, like you traumatized entire generations of people.
Nichole [01:15:37] Which also means you’re not okay. You’re not happy. That’s the thing with abusive people is they’re fucking miserable.
Callie [01:15:45] Right. Yeah, I know.
Nichole [01:15:47] And the abuse is the externalization of their misery-
Callie [01:15:50] Exactly.
Nichole [01:15:50] On other people because they can’t acknowledge or process it.
Callie [01:15:53] But those are not factored into the cost of capitalism, which is the frustrating part, right?
Nichole [01:15:58] No, because we all have to bear that cost, and all of our costs are invisiblized. I don’t know if that’s a word, but it is for today.
Callie [01:16:09] Yeah, exactly.
Nichole [01:16:10] It’s a whiskey word. That’s like Feminism for the 99%. Another book club call out. Like they talk so much about social reproduction and how that kind of labor has been unpaid and, you know, unrecognized for so long. And it’s not just the literal physical raising of children. It’s all of what you were just talking about, too. It’s like bearing the brunt of your husband, coming home, angry and having to do all the housework and also having to train your kids of how to behave and how not to make daddy mad. Or maybe I’m just talking about my own fucking life.
Callie [01:16:48] Nope.
Nichole [01:16:49] But you know what I mean? Right because daddy is earning the, you know, and like, he can’t deal with his feelings so we all have to, like, tiptoe around and figure out how to not piss him off. And it’s like that is not, like we are finally just standing up and saying, like, we’re not going to let this go unpaid or unseen or unspoken about anymore. But it’s not fragility. It’s exhaustion.
Callie [01:17:18] And for no reason. We don’t actually live in a scarcity society, right? Like, there’s no reason why we all need to be, like, burning ourselves out. There’s enough food. There’s enough shelter. There’s enough space. Like, we don’t need to be doing this. There’s no reason why every day every single one of us need to wake up and feel like we have a scarcity of time. There’s literally no reason for that. You know, I shouldn’t be sweating over having to spend a couple hours, like doing chores around my house or whatever. Like that should bring me joy. It should be like, hey, I’m like taking care of myself and my space. But it feels like this is a deduction I can’t afford to take. Because I’m, it’s like a cost-benefit, like those um, like cost-benefits analysis. Right, like everything is so transactional and it’s like, oh, if I spend the time doing this that I’m not doing something else that I should also be doing. Because there’s never enough time. But there’s plenty of time!
Nichole [01:18:16] There’s plenty of time.
Callie [01:18:19] There’s plenty of time.
Nichole [01:18:20] People you used to work like maybe 20 hours a week and be like, great. Everything was great.
Callie [01:18:25] None of us should have to work like more than a couple hours a day.
Nichole [01:18:29] Yeah, exactly. That’s all you need to like, make sure shit’s taken care of. And then you just do whatever the rest of the time.
Callie [01:18:36] Yeah.
Nichole [01:18:37] Yeah, Mohera made a comment about emotional labor and it just like also makes me, to frame it this way that like people like that, the type of, say man, that you’re talking about, it’s like you are externalizing the cost of not being emotional.
Callie [01:18:57] Yes.
Nichole [01:18:59] So we’re not being emotional. We are carrying the weight of the emotions that you are refusing to feel. It’s like another externalized costs of capitalism. And the cishet patriarchy. And white supremacy, of course.
Callie [01:19:13] Yes, bitch.
Nichole [01:19:14] Always white supremacy.
Callie [01:19:16] Yeah.
Nichole [01:19:17] Yeah. And we’re just fuckin sick of it. We just can’t. Like we can’t. I think the situation is finally pushing enough of us that it’s like we just can’t.
Callie [01:19:27] Yeah. Yeah. I just have to highlight this because this comment is too real. Alex posted, “I have so few spoons, I’ve borrowed sporks.” Like I feel that in like the pit of my…
Nichole [01:19:48] Very bones.
Callie [01:19:52] Yeah.
Nichole [01:19:55] OK, y’all have been making me laugh, touching my heart, saying fire things. So I think I have done as much potentially interesting content as I can do. So I, listen, if you’re listening and you’re like, bitch, listen, I know there’s a, there’s a big asterisk there. I gave you the caveat of like of what I’m capable of right now, OK? Meaning I would love to move into the after-party-
Callie [01:20:26] Let’s do it.
Nichole [01:20:28] Section of this.
Callie [01:20:30] Yeah.
Nichole [01:20:31] And maybe I’ll, like, make some rice and eat it in front of all of you.
Callie [01:20:35] Mmm you should.
Nichole [01:20:38] But yeah, so thanks for listening. I know there wasn’t really anything in particular here, but it’s kind of on brand, let’s be honest.
Callie [01:20:45] Yup.
Nichole [01:20:47] If you ever want to join the livestream so that you can comment and chat with us in real-time, we are on YouTube, until they fucking deactivate us for no goddamn reason, every Sunday at 12:00 p.m. Pacific time. And otherwise, just join us here next week.
Callie [01:21:07] Talk to you later.
Nichole [01:21:08] Bye bye!